- Paul and I talked about this a lot Monday night on our radio show, but what if a big reason the Indians were attracted to Acta is not only because he is bi-lingual but that he appears better able to handle communicating and relating to Spanish speaking players from Latin America?
- To expand on that point, when you look back at former manager Eric Wedge’s staff there was no high level coach such as the manager, bench coach, or pitching coach that spoke Spanish or spoke it fluently where they could talk to the Spanish speaking players in their native language. The only two coaches who spoke Spanish were guys in lesser roles like bullpen coach Luis Isaac and first base and infield coach Luis Rivera. I may be mistaken, but while I am sure the likes of Wedge, Carl Willis, Joel Skiller, Jeff Datz and Derrick Shelton all had an ability to speak some Spanish and understand it, I don’t believe they were able to speak the language in lengthy conversations without the use of a translator when talking to a Spanish speaking player. As Acta mentioned last week, his ability to speak both English and Spanish fluently allows him to directly communicate with his players without the use of an interpreter and it ensures nothing is lost in translation.
- This having been said, if you take away look at the three biggest disappointments from 2009 that had nothing to do with an injury, I think an overwhelming majority of people would say those three big disappointments this past season were Fausto Carmona, Rafael Perez, and Jhonny Peralta. All three are Latin players. If the Indians can get those three guys turned around it would absolutely do wonders for all three key areas of the team: the starting rotation, bullpen and lineup.
- In addition to those three players, you also have significant pieces to the puzzle that are from Latin America such as the young keystone combo of Asdrubal Cabrera and Luis Valbuena, two up-and-coming rotation hopefuls in Carlos Carrasco and Hector Rondon, and the star catcher on the horizon in Carlos Santana who the organization hopes will live up to all the hype and become the face of the franchise. While he does have a good handle on the English language, you even have the enigmatic Andy Marte on the roster who was totally lost in his four years under Wedge. Maybe Acta can “reach” him too.
- It really seems like the key to this organization getting on its feet next year and beyond is a lot of these Latin players, and so maybe Acta can help in that regard. I have no idea if he can or will be able to do that, but it is something to think about and his Latin roots certainly may have had a hand in his hiring and intrigued the Indians at least a little bit.
- Moving forward, listening to Acta's press conference on Monday he made it a point to say he likes the lineup, defense, and the bullpen. For the most part, I happen to agree with him as I think the Indians have a lot of pieces in place and more coming to make this at worst a top third ranked offense in baseball. Also, there are certainly a lot of intriguing pieces in the bullpen to work with going forward and there are some more options on the horizon. The defense once Santana gets here is going to be above average or better at every position except third base and first base.
- But while Acta gave high praise to the lineup, bullpen and defense and what he thinks they could be, he candidly shared his concern for the starting rotation. Again, I agree with him. The Indians certainly have a lot of options for the rotation, but the problem is all of those options have huge question marks and no one has established themselves as a reliable starter. We are a long way from the days from 2006-2008 where you knew you had three reliable arms in C.C. Sabathia, Cliff Lee and Jake Westbrook to rely on at the start of every season.
- This rotation needs a lot of work. The question this offseason will be whether the Indians go with the current nine deep staff for next season of Jake Westbrook, Fausto Carmona, Justin Masterson, Aaron Laffey, David Huff, Jeremy Sowers, Carlos Carrasco, Hector Rondon, and Scott Lewis, or will they go out and sign a starter in free agency to a Kevin Millwood-like deal or will they use some of their surplus in the upper levels of the system as far as outfielders, first basemen, catchers, and back-of-the-rotation starters go and make a trade for a young more established, reliable starter?
- I've replayed the part many times in Acta’s press conference where he references the starting rotation. While he did mention the current five man and what they need to do and Carmona being the key to the success of the rotation, I get the sense that maybe just maybe Indians GM Mark Shapiro will go out and dabble into the free agent and trade market to see if an opportunity exists to pick up a young established starter.
- If the Indians spend anything on this roster this offseason, the only place I want it spent is in the starting rotation. And I am not talking going out and blowing $4 million on a Jason Johnson type, no I am instead saying if you are going to spend any money do it to acquire somebody with impact potential in the rotation. Players like Randy Wolf and Orlando Hudson slipped through the cracks last offseason and were bargain one year signings for the Dodgers, and with the economy still not any better this offseason baseball executives believe we will once again see a buyer’s market once the elite free agents go off the board.
- Shapiro has said many times since the Cliff Lee trade that because they moved Lee and Victor Martinez that they will have money to spend this offseason. I’m not sure I buy that, and even so I am not sure I want him to spend other than to add a pitcher or bat that as I mentioned above slips through the cracks. The one thing I do not want to see is Shapiro go out and blow $8-10 million on payroll between three guys to shore up the bench or fill roles. If they are going to invest in the $15 million saved on the 2010 payroll from the Lee/Martinez trades, I sure as hell don’t want them blowing half or more of that on more David Dellucci, Trot Nixon, and Roberto Hernandez types. Either get a meaningful player, or just don’t spend the money. We have more than enough young players already on the team and in the system to round out the 21st through 25th spots on the 25-man roster.
- Young pitching is not often dealt, but for the right deal or scenario it has been done before. Look at Minnesota two years ago as they needed to get a young bat and had some pitching surplus to dangle to find that bat, and they eventually found a trading partner with Tampa Bay and a Matt Garza for Delmon Young deal was completed. Last offseason the same thing happened as Tampa Bay wanted a young bat and they dangled a young starter which they considered a surplus, and when Detroit came calling an Edwin Jackson for Matt Joyce deal was consummated. These are unique deals and very rare, but this is the kind of deal I hope to see the Indians try and make this offseason. I’m not sure which young hitter I would deal, but depending on the pitcher we could maybe get back I would part with anyone not named Carlos Santana. And yes, I am saying for the right starter I would deal Michael Brantley or Matt LaPorta.
- It really depends on how the Indians are approaching the 2010 season. If they truly want to contend, they will go out and find a reliable veteran starter or two. If they are using next season as a transition year to sort through all the options in the rotation, bullpen, and lineup, then they should not go out and sign anyone. They have more than enough starting pitching to use next year if the plan is to throw it all against the wall and see what sticks by the end of the season. Still, considering how the AL Central is the weakest division in all of baseball, you almost have to go into the season with the idea of trying to contend.
- Looking beyond 2010, one thing to note is the massive amount of payroll that comes off the books after the 2010 season with Kerry Wood's $10.5M and Jake Westbrook’s $11.0M coming off the books (assuming Wood doesn’t reach 55 appearances in 2010 which would automatically kick in his 2011 $11M club option). Right now, the Indians only have $23M in guaranteed deals locked up in 2011 and that is all for three players: Grady Sizemore, Fausto Carmona and Travis Hafner. No one else is locked in, though they do have a $7M option for Peralta and by then will have a bevy of arbitration eligible players. Even so, there will be a lot of payroll flexibility next offseason to do some things, and even this offseason since the have the $15M saved from the Martinez/Lee trades to make a few significant moves if they really want to.
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23 comments:
Personally I don't see Shapiro going into the free agent market unless something falls into his lap. I can see a trade or two going down, but not much else, which is ok too.
If they spend money, people are just gonna say Dolan is too cheap to own this team, and what was the point in trading away so and so etc.
-Clay
Nice post. It's hard to imagine them giving up a Laporta or Brantley. The two KEY important pieces in the C.C. deal.
I do agree that we DO need Starting pitching. also, I do agree that if they do spend some money make it an impact starter. NO Jason Johnson's please.
You know what would be an interesting deal? Jair Jurrjens for Matt Laporta. What would you think of that? A 23 year old with a 14-10 record and a 2.60 ERA. They just signed hudson and already have Lowe, Vazquez,Kawakami, and Tommy Hanson. Looks like they need a bat, and we could probably afford to give one up.
Jurrjens, Masterson, Corrasco, Rondon, Huff, could be a pretty decent rotation for the future, and that is saying that Carmona will never be worth anything (which hopefully isn't true), and discounting guys like Knapp, Hagadone, Gomez, White, Dela Cruz. Who knows... Maybe I just really want for something really good to be happening but it seems like at least five of those guys could pan out right?
Between Laffey, Masterson, Westbrook and Carmona, the Indians need to try and find some room for the young guys. It is not going to be possible to find time for Rondon/Carrasco/Huff to all be in the rotation at the same time at any point in the near future.
I think a legitimate starting pitcher would be a great thing for this team, but the fact of the matter is that they clearly have 10 guys that are Quadruple-A or MLB material as a starting pitcher.
Laffey is probably #1 at this point, while if healthy, Westbrook, Masterson, Carmona and Huff also have to be in the rotation. Then where do Carrasco and Sowers start the year? What about if Scotty Lewis is back and healthy? Is Rondon stuck in Columbus until further notice? Is there absolutely no future as starters for prospects like Jeanmar Gomez, Josh Tomlin, Scott Barnes, Eric Berger, et al?
I totally forgot about guys like Laffey, Barnes. I totally agree. The young guys need to pitch. But some type of stabilization could go a long way into helping them with confidence as well.
Not sure if Jurrjens is the type of pitcher Atlanta is looking to deal or if LaPorta is the type of hitter Cleveland is willing to move just yet.
Don't know what Tony or Paul think, but IMO Masterson (quickly became a new favorite of mine), Carrasco and Rondon each have enough ability/potential to become that type of starter that Jurrjens is and exactly what Carmona is capible of being again.
Guys like Knapp, Hagadone, White, House are all a long way off still, and Scott Lewis can't be counted on to be healthy, he just can't be.
There is a lot of depth there to work with, and Shapiro should be able to put together a solid five man before long.
The more I think about it, the more of a slap in the face it would be to the fans if Shapiro did go out and spend $7-8M this offseason on a starting pitcher. Reason being, you had Lee in the fold for $8M in 2010 and he is a far cry better than anything you could find off the scrap heap this offseason or in a salary dump trade. With that in mind, it may not be pretty and will require a lot of patience, but the best course of action is probably to go with this nine-deep staff and use the 162 games in 2010 as a way of sorting it all out. There is a lot of upside there with Huff, Rondon, and Carrasco....some unknown with Fausto, Jake, and Justin....and we know pretty much what we will get from Laffey, Sowers and Lewis who are just 5th starter types and depth guys (though I admit Laffey could potentially be more a #3/#4 guy).
One thing to consider is it looks like there is a log jam at LF and 1B which may need lead to a trade at some point. There is no rush at the moment now because some guys are not ready (Weglarz) and/or have lots of options remaining (Brown), but they have three everyday capable players for two spots with Brantley, LaPorta and Brown. Brown is on the outside looking in with the 25-man roster this year (he will be rostered on the 40-man!), so it is possible he could end up being moved at some point this year or next offseason. Or, the Indians may like Brown as a fallback in the event they can get a top notch young starter and have to deal a LaPorta/Brantley.
Jurrgens is a pipedream if you ask me. He's a fixture in that Atlanta rotation. Guys like Matt Garza and Edwin Jackson did not have nearly as strong a toe hold on the rotation as him.....that's what I am looking for. A team that has a good young pitcher maybe not valued as much as he should be or considered expendable because of depth at the position.
It will be interesting to see how it all shakes out. Laffey and Sowers are out of options, so both need to be in the rotation when the season starts next year (unless they are hurt and DLed), otherwise they will be lost on waivers or traded. Westbrook is on the DL or in the rotation, Masterson is a lock, and so is Carmona (out of options). Yet their win leader in 2009 David Huff would be on the outside looking in while their top two pitching prospects Carrasco and Rondon would seem to open in Columbus. I think it is possible Rondon/Carrasco open in Columbus and see no problem with that, as they will certainly be used over the course of the season as guys get hurt or flame out. But will be interesting to see how they handle Huff....would seem one of Laffey/Sowers would be let go in some way to ensure Huff is in the rotation.
We all want stabilization in the rotation, and the guy who very well might do it is Westbrook as he is expected to be ready to go come spring training. In a way, there is your free agent signing for the rotation.
I can't see the Tribe trading LaPorta because of the lack of right handed hitters. If LaPorta is traded for a starter and you put Brown in there at first, that gives you seven leftys in the projected opening day lineup if you include Cabrera. Do you think a team would take Brown, who doesn't seem to have a future in this organization unfortunately, for a young starter as you described?
Personally...I wouldn't miss Laffey, but I do like him as a starter, but feel there are better options available. Plus he's been
a bit injury prone. If a team showed interest in Laffey and Brown/McBride (longshot we'd get anthing for that) I'd listen in.
Frankly, if there are any options already in house ready, I choose, Carmona, Masterson, and eventually Rondon and Carrasco. Lefty of no lefty, those 4 to me have a ton of upside IMO.
It's hard to explain, but I just like what I saw in Justin Masterson as a starter. The kid was drafted in 2006 and was nearly thrown into the fire in Boston right away without IMO being anywhere finished off as a prospect and no defined roll. He did everything but close there and it shows me that he has a thick skin mentality, able to handle whatever is thrown at him. (Plus he looked like a beast in his last start against Chicago)
The Tribe's most consistent starter, the AAA batting champion, and a versitile player who had 99 RBI. That would give you a pretty good player. I like Laffey. He struggled in September, but he was lights out in July-August.
I didn't necessarily mean all three together, Laffey with either one, depending on what the team was looking for.
I could see an NL team biting.
I dont' meant to sound like I think Laffey should be traded either....I was just using him as an example.
If Laffey was on another team, we would probably be sitting here saying the Tribe should go after him. As Rick Manning says about once an hour, I think they made a mistake sending him to the bullpen. He could have really established himself as a starter, and he probably wouldn't have gotten hurt had he been a starter the whole season. If you look at this rotation, we all know what he have in Westbrook when healthy. You can't overlook Huff's 11 wins even though he had a high ERA, you have to be pretty good to win 11 games on a bad team. Masterson and Carmona are obviously incredibly talented and maybe if we get the right pitching coach and those two are pitching to their potential, we could have a solid rotation with Carrasco and Rondon on the way. Then, of course, you have Laffey. If they can make a trade to get a talented young starter for a Brown or a McBride, that would only help.
P.S. Please don't spend money! There is nobody out there that the Tribe could use that is in their price range, and as Tiny said, we'll end up with a couple of Delluccis or Nixons.
I couldn't agree more about Laffey to the bullpen, I argued with people on the ESPN forums for weeks about that move.
Laffey was the first starter to go more than 6 innings in 2009 if I'm not mistaken, so Wedge tossed him into the pen to make long relief saves.
It made zero sense to me.
Sorry about misspelling your name Tony. Also, people say that we don't have an ace. That is true, but going into 2008, did you think Cliff Lee would turn into an ace? Did you think Edwin Jackson would become the pitcher he is for Detroit? You never know who will emerge from the staff and become a ace.
I think it is very possible that Brown could be moved this offseason. Quite possibly in the next few weeks prior to the roster deadline. It's not secret he was pretty unhappy with not being called up in September, and I can't imagine he would be very happy having to go back to Columbus next year. With LaPorta at 1B, hafner at DH and Brantley in LF to open next season, it looks like that is almost certain to happen to Brown (assuming everyone is healthy).
I agree with GoTribe on J-Mas. A full offseason to prepare for starting duty to go along with some growth as a pitcher and getting stronger to me may be the difference in him being a lot more consistent.
As for the Laffey + Brown/McBride trade scenario, I think there is some merit there and teams will be calling the Indians looking for 4th/5th starters to fill out their rotations. We certainly have a lot of those 4th/5th types. FYI, Brown has a lot more value than McBride in a trade though.
I think this rotation is not as bad as it looks to a lot of people.....just gonna take some patience and the right guy at pitching coach and manager to mold them.
I would rather move Sowers to the pen just because he has troubles getting through the lineup the third time around. I do understand where your coming from though with Laffey and his ground ball outs.
I don't like the idea of trading Laporta/Brantley. Brantley is the prototypical lead-off hitter, which will move Grady down closer to the middle of the order. Matt has the potential to be a nice middle of the order hitter.
I think I would hold on to all of the young guys. (Laporta, Brantley etc.) I also agree that Brown doesn't have a future with the indians especially with Laporta and Brantley. (crowe?)
Also, Huff had a ton of run support.
Thats true about Huff, but he did finish the season looking stronger with something like 5-6 quality starts.
The only thing that worries me with Huff is his strikeout total. Without looking I think he had something like 60K's to 40 walks on the year
Damn Spankees won =(
IT was Huff's rookie year though, and control is his thing. He has the fastball that can run up there 92-93, and if he can get the control going and the confidence he would be a very similar pitcher to Lee, (obviously not now), but down the road.
I just would be shocked if the Indians could scrounge up any more pitching than they did at the deadline that would actually make a difference. I mean think about what they had to give up. I don't think Brown/Mcbride+ Laffey could get much at all unless it would be a low A prospect. Another pitcher with decent ceiling but far away.
Tony- you mentioned getting the right pitching coach. Is Radinsky the guy? He has worked with several of these guys already and their struggles are the reason we are in the situation we are now. He might be a good fit in another role, such as bullpen coach as he interviewed for prior to this season. I think they need a totally new voice and opinion for pitching coach. There are some guys that can turn waiver claims into solid pitchers. I'm not saying go after one of those guys but someone experienced that is smart when it comes to pitching. I have no problem promoting from the minor leagues for the other positions.
Any chance the Yanks finally decide they have no use for Phil Hughes any longer?
Seems to me like that have no desire to put him into their rotation and Joe Girardi can't trust anyone out of the pen not named Rivera any longer so....hell why not?
I'm a big fan of Radinsky. I get the idea that a new voice is needed, but in a lot of ways would consider him a new voice at the big league level. He is really a lot different from Willis, even with how much of a "familiar" voice he has. I'm not sure bringing in a new pitching coach with an entirely different philosophy and coaching techniques is what such a young staff needs. They need stability more than anything if you ask me, as well as a guy who knows what the hell they are doing.;-)
I think this offseason there will be some movement with the roster. Guys like Brown and some of the pitching could all be dealt. For what who knows...but there could be some interest for sure.
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